Reclaim You- Unpacking Perimenopause
Season 2 Episode 16: Athletes Mental Health Challenges with Paige Thompson
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Tune in as Sarah and Laura pull back the curtain on perimenopause on today's episode. They dive into the physical and emotional rollercoaster that comes with this transitional phase, offering a mix of personal stories and practical knowledge.
From hormone havoc to mental health hurdles, Laura is sharing common symptoms folks might experience throughout perimenopause. They explore why society often goes quiet about menopause and discuss ways to break this silence.
You'll get hands-on tips for managing symptoms, prioritizing self-care, and building your support crew.
Whether you're in the midst of perimenopause or supporting someone who is, this episode offers valuable perspectives on embracing this new life chapter. Listen in for a candid, informative, and ultimately uplifting discussion that brings the perimenopausal experience into the open.
Thanks for listening to Reclaim You with Reclaim Therapy!
To learn more about Reclaim Therapy and how to work with a therapist on the team, head to https://www.reclaimtherapy.org.
Be sure to comment, like and subscribe here, or on YouTube and come follow along on Instagram!
More on Perimenopause Symptoms
When Perimenopause Feels Like I'm Dying: Coping with Horrible Perimenopause Symptoms
Perimenopause is a transitional phase filled with unpredictable hormonal shifts that can wreak havoc on both your body and mind. Many women describe experiencing horrible perimenopause symptoms—from relentless hot flashes and night sweats to mood swings and anxiety—that leave them “not feeling like myself” in perimenopause . These intense physical and emotional changes often trigger a profound sense of loss and confusion, as your body begins to signal that a major shift is underway.
Perimenopause Depression
In our recent podcast episode, we discussed the realities of perimenopause and how these overwhelming symptoms can affect mental health. The conversation revealed that while the physical signs of perimenopause are well-known, the emotional toll—feelings of vulnerability, despair, and the struggle to maintain a sense of normalcy—is equally significant. This period of life can be incredibly isolating if you feel that your experiences are unique, yet they are far more common than you might think.
If you’re finding that these drastic changes are disrupting your daily life, know that help is available. Whether through medical advice, lifestyle adjustments, or mental health therapy, seeking support can empower you to navigate this challenging time. Embracing your journey with the right guidance may help you reclaim balance and transform overwhelming symptoms into a pathway for personal growth and self-care.
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Sarah (00:37)
Hey everybody, welcome back to Reclaim You. Laura is here today and we're going to be talking all about perimenopause and the many, many things that can come along with that.
Laura Gordon (00:46)
Yes, many.
Sarah (00:48)
Many, many. Let's start by sharing about your book that you
Laura Gordon (00:51)
So this book was actually recommended to me by a number of people, but it's by Heather Corina. What fresh hell is this? Corina, I'm not sure how to say their last name, so I apologize, Heather. But basically looking at perimenopause, menopause, and just what it means to be a person who has, you know.
Sarah (01:00)
Mmm.
Laura Gordon (01:11)
the organs of ovaries and a uterus and all of that stuff and what it means to begin to age and move into a different part of life. So, but they're really funny. They, they talk about their own experiences, but they also offer a lot of good data. And so it's a really good mix. keeps you reading and interested and, and I guess just, I felt less alone.
Sarah (01:18)
Mm.
Mm.
I've been seeing a lot on Instagram. I don't know why the algorithm has me here about perimenopause content lately, but the algorithm's got me. So I've been watching it a lot. So it's interesting that we're recording this after seeing some more talk that I think I've ever maybe seen before about perimenopause. I don't know. It's listening. It's listening. Like, ooh, what are all these hormonal shifts happening? Yeah.
Laura Gordon (01:50)
Maybe your maybe your phone's just really listening.
Mm Yeah. Yeah. Yep. Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. What fresh hell is this? Yeah, they really chose a great title. I appreciate it. Yeah, so. So that's a that's a really great resource out there. And we'll talk about resources a little later. But I mean, certainly that's one that will give you a really full overview. And it also looks at the history of women's health and like
Sarah (02:00)
What Fresh Hell is This? That's a perfect title.
Laura Gordon (02:20)
why it is that this isn't something we talk about, some of the injustice. So they do a really good job of exploring that as well.
Sarah (02:27)
Let's talk a little bit about, to start, like what is perimenopause? Because we hear about menopause, I don't know if a lot does not quantify it. No, we hear about menopause sometimes, more so than perimenopause. So let's start there. Like, what is it?
Laura Gordon (02:34)
Yes.
Sure, sure. Yeah. So perimenopause is basically this transitional period, right? That's leading up to menopause. Menopause, the definition of that is that you've gone 12 or more months without a period, right? But perimenopause is this, it's this period of time of transition until that point. And it can range in terms of how long it lasts. I mean, some women, it might be
a few years, other women, it can be decades. So it varies so widely and isn't really widely studied. It's becoming more studied, I think, over time. But typically the duration would be four to 10 years and the onset would be somewhere in your 40s, though there are some women who can go into an early perimenopause transition in their 30s, some rarer that in their 50s might start the process.
And that's all assuming that you haven't had any type of surgery or aren't on any type of medications or maybe having chemo that could impact that process. So to just be mindful that there are ways in which the perimenopause process can be trumped by other things that are going on, especially like a hysterectomy, things like that are going to take you right to menopause.
Sarah (04:00)
Mm-hmm. Yeah. Yeah. So what happens during perimenopause?
Laura Gordon (04:04)
Yeah, so I think it was Heather who talked about in the book, basically, it's reverse puberty, but sort of not right. But but but like puberty, is that one of those times of life that we remember fondly?
Sarah (04:12)
Mm-hmm
yeah, right? Like, no.
Laura Gordon (04:19)
Do we all just look back and just love that, especially those of us who had to deal with the onset of our periods and what that meant? no, like basically at that point you're going from low hormone levels and then your hormones are all over the place. And anyone who's had, especially like a teenager in their home who's going through this could tell you some things. And so
Sarah (04:43)
You
Laura Gordon (04:44)
What happens here is that now the hormones are beginning, they start to vacillate, they're sort of all over the place. And basically your body is beginning to move toward not having a regular cycle anymore, right? It's like your reproductive stage of life, if you will, is moving toward the end of it. Though you still can get pregnant in perimenopause. So it's important to talk to your doctor about what that means and how you need to tend to that.
But yeah, so basically there's three hormones that are most involved estrogen, progesterone, and the follicle stimulating hormone. So you might, the fluctuations of those in your body lead to a lot of things like not least of which is menstrual cycle irregularity, which some people might start to notice some shifts. Some of us were never regular. Some of us are on birth control. So it's not always obvious. But
You also are going to see physical, emotional, mental health changes. so there's it's basically it was really interesting to read like the receptors for some of these hormones are like throughout our whole body. So our entire system, our entire body is impacted by this stage of life by perimenopause and menopause. So, yeah, you're going to see a lot of changes and we'll get into the specifics of that.
Sarah (05:54)
yeah. Now that does feel so important, especially when we're talking about mental health and can impact mental health, right? The physical health and mental health aspects really go together. Yeah.
Laura Gordon (06:05)
Mm Yeah, you can't you can't separate them from each other.
Sarah (06:08)
Mm.
Laura Gordon (06:09)
And I think there's this, know, lately because my algorithm as well is tuned into this, you know, there's been a lot of memes floating around and other things, you know, like the typical woman who's in perimenopause or menopause. And there's this particular like image we have of that person who's just emotions all over the place. Like it's just snapping at you, you know, is like sweating and on fire. And while, yeah, there's truth to all of that.
Some of that portrayal of this stage of life also has stigmatized it in a way where women don't want to talk about it. They don't want to be perceived in any way as emotionally volatile or, you know, which is legit. Your hormones are all over the place. And it's not that you can't control it. It's that your body is shifting and changing and you're feeling the effects of that. So we kid around about it as women and I think that's okay.
Sarah (06:56)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Laura Gordon (07:00)
But when society as a whole has some things to say about it that stigmatize it, we just need to be mindful of that.
Sarah (07:05)
Mm-hmm, yeah. And I do think that people talk about it, of course people joke about it in the teenage years, like the angsty years, right? But it's kind of like more permission is given or more grace is given for teens going through that stage of life where the hormones are coming in really hot than folks who are older and are experiencing a very similar process. Like you said, the reversal of the Not as much grace is given for what actually is going on.
Laura Gordon (07:12)
Mm-hmm.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah.
No, no, no. And you have the underlying issues too, of just like women in general, like if we if women are, in some respects, or historically have been betrayed as you know, their, their utility and society is to bear children, which is problematic for other reasons, which we don't need to get into. But now you're you know, this is a huge part of what it means to be in the body that is
Sarah (07:47)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (07:53)
a female body. And now that stage, that period of time when you can bear children is over. So, you know, what does that mean about who you are? And there's a lot of like women just sort of, we get to a certain age and society sort of just pushes us aside. We're silenced, right? Like, and yet women at this age and older have so much wisdom.
And just so much, you know, some folks kid around, it's like the I don't give a fuck period of life, right? I'm not going to be held down by the bullshit that held me down for, you know, the first half of my life. Now I have these freedoms potentially let me live into them. You know, but we are up against some societal things still. And that's sad. And part of that is just not knowing a lot about perimenopause, which is why we're here today.
Sarah (08:22)
Yeah. Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah, sure. I'm just thinking about how for folks who have experienced trauma and maybe complex trauma and how the body holds so much of that. I think our practice in particular sees a lot of people at midlife coming into the practice looking to do some healing work. And I haven't ever thought about this before, but maybe there's some connection of like experiencing some of this upheaval on top of the dysregulation that's inherent from trauma.
Laura Gordon (08:53)
Hmm.
Yes.
Sarah (09:08)
Like, my gosh, I need to figure this out. I need to do healing work. Understanding the workings of their body just a little bit more deeply. Just, I don't know, feels like a little connection that just came into my mind.
Laura Gordon (09:15)
Mm-hmm.
Absolutely. Yeah, yeah. And we can touch upon that a little bit more as we get into like the symptoms. But for sure. Yeah, like already existing conditions, particularly mental health conditions, medical conditions, but already existing conditions or like unhealed parts of us certainly can be further exacerbated by this period of life.
Sarah (09:23)
huh.
Would this feel like an okay time to talk about more of the symptoms of what's, you know, the deep dive into everything that shifts and changes and shows up? Let's do it.
Laura Gordon (09:40)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah, let's do it. I think there's the things that like, mostly hear about, know, one being hot flashes, right? Like it's the typical like, at a certain age, women are just like having their moment. And this is the vasomotor symptoms, right? So hot flashes, night sweats, chills. basically, statistics show that 75 to 80 % of women in perimenopause actually experience these
and things like hot flashes can also like kick off or be started by like other things like heart palpitations, panic attacks, like hopelessness and dread. So there's an impact mentally as well. or just think about it. Like I have a hot flash in the middle of a public place. I'm sweating profusely everywhere. Right. And I, and I'm like red as can be in like, there's just a certain way we might feel. so.
And then there's night sweats. I've started to experience these from time to time and they're not pleasant, right? They disturb your sleep. You wake up and you're like soaked and you're like, do I have a fever? Like what's going on? And it took me, it took me like a a couple nights of this to be like, maybe this is not, I'm not sick. Like this is something else going on. So yeah, like taking, like, like just being mindful of that, like layers, have a fan, cooling sheets and pillows and stuff like that.
Sarah (10:37)
Mm-hmm.
huh.
Laura Gordon (10:58)
Heather does a good job of like giving a lot of information related to like ways that you can tend to yourself and help yourself during all of these aspects of perimenopause. So yeah, yeah, that those that's the that's the area that I think we talked about a lot. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think the one that you know, as you were alluding to earlier, the psychological and emotional changes, right? This is like,
Sarah (11:12)
Yeah, yeah, the hot flashes for sure. Yeah.
Laura Gordon (11:22)
you're having all these hormonal fluctuations, right? Our bodies are going through these fluctuations on a daily basis or within the day. So we might find that anxiety, depression or increase. We might be more irritable. There's mood swings or we're having trouble regulating our emotions because of what's going on. And then like if we're not getting adequate sleep already because of some of the other changes going on.
that can further exacerbate these symptoms and vice versa. So it's definitely like a whole lot of things that we might find are worsening, if you will, or And a 2020 study that talked about women, particularly in early menopause, have a higher risk for depressive symptoms.
So just something to be mindful of. Also, as you alluded to, if we have PTSD, eating disorder, or if there's any trauma, even if we haven't been diagnosed officially or formally, those things as well could be exacerbated by what's going on. mean, think about it. Your body is going to go through some major changes, which we'll get into. That certainly is going to impact body image, could impact ED symptoms.
And if you have a history of trauma and now things are happening in your body that are changing it, it could bring up some memories that are embodied memories that then lead us into having to do some of that trauma work around it. So I mean, we talked about the societal stigma. mean, that's certainly like having to address that.
With everything going on, depending on the support we have, depending on like our stress levels, you know, we could see increased things like addiction, suicidality at times. So like looking at that, like your stress level as well is so important to consider because stress increases, cortisol increases, inflammation increases, right? Like all that stuff happening isn't helping us at all. So stress management is one of those things, which is...
easier said than done as we know, right? Yeah. And for me, I think too, like grief, right? Like literally the grief about changes that are happening physically, emotionally, all that stuff. But I think, you know, who am I now that I no longer bear children? Or for some of us, we never had children for various Some of that might be by choice, but some of it might not have been. And so there can be
Sarah (13:18)
Easier said than done.
Hmm.
Laura Gordon (13:41)
things that come up around that that are unique to the individual's lived And, you know, I think about, I didn't have kids for various reasons. And there has been grief that I've been having to tend to in my own person related to like, it's really over now. Like the odds every year, you know, once I turned a certain age, it was like every year you just feel like, okay, I'm getting closer and closer can be a lot of pressure.
Sarah (14:02)
Hmm.
Laura Gordon (14:06)
at the end of our child bearing years to like try and get pregnant, which can also lead to lot of stressors in our lives. So there could be a lot to work on with a therapist for sure. Yeah.
Sarah (14:13)
Mm.
Yeah, that's for sure. That's filled with grief all over the place.
Laura Gordon (14:21)
So yeah, I think that that's like, you know, it's also like, you're not young anymore. And I think that really hit me personally, recently in the past few years where I was like, I was well, always, I spent a good portion of my career working in a college environment. So that kept me young, I think, in a lot of ways.
Sarah (14:27)
Right.
you
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (14:42)
When I worked in the church, I kind of had all years that I was dealing with. But it's recently I've really started to feel my age, like not being as aware of things that are going on, just feeling like. I don't know, like I never thought I would be that person to be like, you know, just completely throwing shade at, you know, ways that younger people are acting. And I find that I'm that becoming that person like.
Sarah (15:02)
Ha
Laura Gordon (15:06)
am I now that going to be that woman? But, you know, there's good reason for part of it is just lived experience and wisdom. And, you know, part of it is irritability. So, yeah, so I think that all of that to say that, like, you know, this is an aging process. And so also looking at like, what changes come about as we age.
Sarah (15:12)
Yeah, absolutely.
huh.
Laura Gordon (15:27)
what abilities start to be compromised as we age. Like this is sort of the precipice of all of this in a lot of ways.
Sarah (15:34)
Yeah, and what beliefs do we have about aging, right? Like what meaning of aging do we make for ourselves too?
Laura Gordon (15:36)
Indeed.
Yes, yes, yeah, and do we encounter in the world at large, right? A good friend of mine and a colleague had let her hair go gray. And at the time she was in her 40s, like probably mid 40s. And she let her hair go completely gray and she looked fabulous, right? Like, and she's got this amazing personality, so much charisma.
Sarah (15:44)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (16:01)
and then I noticed at a function that we were at, like a year later, she had dyed her hair again. And so I asked her about it and she said, people just didn't see me. I was treated differently. I wasn't, she said, people, you know, and, and she's like, I walk into a room and you notice me, but when my hair was gray, I was treated differently and I was noticed far less. Yeah. So dying her hair became a way to be seen again.
Sarah (16:10)
Wow.
Mmm.
Wow.
Yeah, wow.
Laura Gordon (16:27)
Mm-hmm. Yeah, so those are important things for us to just be mindful of Yeah, and you're not you're not you know, some people like am I crazy like what's going on? Like, you know, some of my clients and friends of mine. It's like no, no, no There's like legit stuff happening here both like individually to the person but also in the greater world that's impacting you It's okay to feel this way. Let's talk about it
Sarah (16:33)
Yeah, it's real.
Uh-huh.
Right, Yeah.
Laura Gordon (16:50)
I think like also looking at cognitive changes as well, right? Like hormonal changes, definitely people talk about brain fog, like forgetting things. I I forget things often anyway. I was undiagnosed ADHD for most of my life. But it...
Sarah (17:03)
Anyway.
Bye.
Laura Gordon (17:09)
You know, these things can be like those of us who are neurodivergent that can be exacerbated by this stage. You know, just forgetfulness, I lose things, I misplace things more than usual. So, you know, that sort of comes up as well. And that can lead to further stress. And, know, it's just sort of all this like, it's all connected and it all feeds into each other. And yeah, yeah, exactly.
Sarah (17:14)
Mm-hmm.
Right, it's all connected.
Yeah, yeah. And just knowing though, like knowing that all of these symptoms we've talked about and you're gonna continue to talk about, that they're normal, I think it helps you feel a little less like othered and like there's something wrong with you, right? These are all natural processes that are happening in our bodies and might just inform the way that we care for ourselves in terms of like self-talk and stepping outside of shame and all of those types of things that we talk about on the podcast.
Laura Gordon (17:38)
Yes.
Yes.
Exactly.
Yes, yeah, for sure. You know, the most important aspect of caring for ourselves is to put ourselves first in the midst of this and really be aware and seek the support that you need. And we'll get into that at the end. But yeah, part of that is self-talk and how we've seen ourselves till this point might shift dramatically. And that might be an amazing thing.
Sarah (18:15)
it might be and it might be filled with grief, right? Everyone's process is to be so different. Yeah.
Laura Gordon (18:18)
Sure. Yeah, that's the thing is there's no like, there's no, this happens to everyone. And this doesn't happen. You know, it's just so individualized. And that, I think is what can be difficult because we can feel alone, but you know, we're not. And we need to talk about it more. We need to, as women, just bring this into the light and encourage this to just be a natural part of conversation, just like anything else.
Sarah (18:38)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, so if you're listening to this, the Instagram algorithm might get you. Which might be really helpful in normalizing, so here's hoping.
Laura Gordon (18:45)
Yes, it might.
I hope Other symptoms, if that's helpful, you know, certainly sleep disturbances. I think I mentioned that before. Anything else going on can impact your sleep, but your sleep in general might be disturbed because of what's happening hormonally. And studies show insomnia and restless sleep affect up to 60 % of perimenopausal.
Sarah (18:53)
Mm-hmm.
Ha
Laura Gordon (19:12)
So that's a significant portion of us that are going to experience some sort of sleep disturbance. And so there might be things that you need to do to tend to that. And we mentioned some of that before. But also some women choose to like, just sleep by themselves, or some people I should say, because not all people going through perimenopause identify as female or as woman.
Sarah (19:14)
That is.
Laura Gordon (19:33)
But some choose to if they have a partner sleep separately from the partner or like for them, but also for their partner because it can be so disruptive. So just things to think about. Yeah, so like that's all going on. And so like, you know, in general, if any of these things happen in a given week at any age, would kind of like throw us off our game. And now this is all happening, you know, and sort of feeding into one another. And pain, too, is a big part of this. And I don't know that we talk about this.
Sarah (19:49)
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (19:58)
as much. But our estrogen levels are declining. And there is this correlation between that and increased muscular skeletal pain. Add to that stress related to life and or just I'm in that can further exacerbate the pain that you're feeling, right? The cortisol, the inflammation.
I think that the other half of that though is that there are some things that might decrease in pain. So like if you were a person who had really challenging periods where you a lot of cramps or things like that, you might experience that now less because you're having them less often. So some of that might be decreasing. Some of the things that came up in my readings and in articles and stuff that I was looking at, like things like restless leg syndrome, many women experience, low back spine pain.
Sarah (20:40)
Interesting.
Laura Gordon (20:44)
migraines and tension headaches, increased allergies and sinus pain, dizziness, vertigo, and then you can also have the vulval vaginal and uterine pain as well with what's happening. like, basically what we're saying here is like your whole body could be in pain.
Sarah (20:59)
Your whole body is doing these weird things. Of course you're having pain.
Laura Gordon (21:01)
Yes. Yes. And maybe for you. Yeah, exactly. Like, yeah, your whole body is experiencing this hormonal fluctuation that goes on for quite a while. And so yeah, like pain is a part of that. And so sometimes that's tough, right? Because we're having pain, we go to the doctor. And what happens often is if the doctors are not aware or informed, they don't think about perimenopause.
They don't think to be like, you know, maybe this is perimenopausal. Instead, you wind up getting all these tests and all these other things going on, and you feel like you're crazy because they're like, well, nothing's wrong with you. You're fine. And here it might just be that this is perimenopause. Yeah. So just to consider that before you're like, you know, going down WebMD to the depths of I must have some sort of terrible thing happening with me, let's remember this might just be natural hormonal changes and the impact of them on the body.
Sarah (21:34)
Right.
yeah. Yep.
Yeah, and mention it to your doctor if they're not mentioning it to you.
Laura Gordon (21:54)
Exactly. Yeah, yeah. Definitely, definitely. And there's nothing wrong in like pursuing with your doctor's advice, like testing for other things. I mean, you know your history, your doctor knows your history. That's but yeah, to consider this as part of that equation.
Sarah (22:08)
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (22:09)
Yeah, I think, you know, digestive issues as well go along with that. Like just in general, like, yeah, you're going to have digestive issues. You're going to have changes to, things like, you know, it used to really be easy when I was sexually aroused to be lubricated, to get wet, if you will. And now I'm experiencing vaginal dryness.
Sarah (22:14)
you
Laura Gordon (22:29)
burning, irritation, and that has an effect on my sex life, my arousal. I might have increased pain because of these things, whether it's on the daily or when I'm having There can be increased infections or imbalances, UTIs, infections, things like that. And then the other thing too is urinary urgence or incontinence. This is where those ads for poise pads become relevant.
Sarah (22:48)
you
huh.
Laura Gordon (22:53)
especially women who've had children, anecdotally have told me, yeah, that's like an issue. But yeah, like I wake up now many times during the night. More than I mean, I used to maybe get up once during the night. Now I'm up at least twice. there's just an urgency that might not have been there you want to get checked for UTI and things like that. Sure. But part of this, again, it's just these changes are.
Sarah (22:55)
huh.
Mm. Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (23:14)
Yeah.
Sarah (23:15)
there's a sleep disturbance too. Right, like on top of everything else, there's more sleep disturbance.
Laura Gordon (23:17)
yeah. Exactly. And think about, like, if if that's starting to happen, like just to go out in public and to be like, my gosh, like what's going on with my bladder? You know, which is why now we have things like boys pads and like the they have the period underwear, but they also have the P underwear, right? So like, I don't I don't know that we give enough credit to like this is these are all
Sarah (23:29)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (23:39)
These are all more things I need to consider in my everyday life, right? Yeah. Yeah. And have anxiety about and, so, so yeah. So, and again, as we're listing all these symptoms, it's not to say that everyone has all these symptoms. They don't. Some people have pretty easy paramenopause. Other people, it's really hard. Some people are in the middle. So, you know, to not freak out that
Sarah (23:42)
Right, yeah, and how to prepare for and yeah, make sure you have what you need. Yeah.
Right, right.
Laura Gordon (24:05)
this is the end of everything that you've known. No, but just keep in mind that there are going to be these And I that brings us to body changes, right? So the body at large is changing. We've covered some of the specifics, but your size, your weight might change. And to think about it, like your primary estrogen source until this time has been your female reproductive system, right? And now,
that is turning off, if you will, and your primary storage of estrogen is coming from fat. So the body naturally is going to start to store fat. It's going to redistribute fat, especially in the stomach area. there's this great I found in Heather's book by Dr. Margot Mayne, who said, your belly fat is not your spare tire. It's your life preserver. So this is like a body's natural way to start to prepare for aging.
Sarah (24:30)
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (24:53)
As you age, having a little bit more fat on you can be helpful if you're facing some significant health issues, can be helpful if you fall, right? Like there's ways in which they can be helpful. So to think about, you know, all these changes are happening in our body. My metabolism is changing. All this stuff is happening. Yet in a way, your body is just naturally moving into a new state. It has a lot of wisdom.
The same work we do with trusting our bodies when it comes to ED stuff is the same work we do here. How do we trust our bodies? How do we stay attuned to our bodies? How do we have neutrality around our bodies? How do we not get sucked into diet culture, which is just as present here as it was when we were younger? So those are things to keep in mind. Your nails, your hair, your
Sarah (25:25)
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
Laura Gordon (25:39)
facial hair now, right? Like we're carrying tweezers all the time. You know, if we had PCOS before, we might know what that's yeah, the body is changing dramatically.
Sarah (25:41)
Mm-hmm. Yep.
Yeah, and the research shows that the most common times for folks to experience an eating disorder is, you know, adolescence and then again at midlife, which makes a lot of sense with all of these changes that are happening in the body to the body and how we start to feel really uncomfortable in our own bodies because it's like a whole new landscape.
Laura Gordon (25:57)
Yeah.
Yeah, yeah, for real. And this is where we see like, you know, our society, I think it's just getting progressively more normal for people to engage in things like plastic surgery or other types of ways to tend to their bodies. I think we used to see it more at this age and probably still do. But I'm seeing any younger and younger people who are having procedures and and you know, we have these
Sarah (26:24)
Mm-hmm.
Younger. Yeah.
Laura Gordon (26:31)
these places people can go to get all these different treatments, you know, and so it's easy to get swept up in that.
Sarah (26:34)
Mm-hmm.
sure is. Yeah, it sure is.
Laura Gordon (26:39)
in your social circle, in society. And again, this is where that work, and if you've done that work before, it's calling upon skills you already have in place.
Sarah (26:48)
I might call you to get back into a similar type of work in this season of your life to take it maybe a step deeper.
Laura Gordon (26:52)
Yeah. Yeah, indeed. Indeed. think that's a really, it's a really good time to step into like, this is a major transition point. What does this mean? Not just on a, you know, not just on the day to day, but what does this mean in terms of my life, in terms of my path, my identity? Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Yeah.
Sarah (26:58)
Yeah.
Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (27:12)
I think the only other thing related to like the body and symptoms like obviously this goes hand in hand with everything else going on, sex and sexuality can change, Like fluctuations in desire, it can go up, go down, it can go all over the place. And then like also just changes in the physical and emotional experiences of sex. If sex is painful, that shifts the experience, right?
Sarah (27:22)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. Yeah.
Laura Gordon (27:36)
So some things to keep in mind.
Sarah (27:38)
Anything else that you feel like we should mention about challenges around this period of time?
Laura Gordon (27:43)
yeah, we talked a little bit about like the taboos around aging and menopause. And I think keeping that in mind, there was a 2020 survey that was published in women's midlife health, and it showed that 70 % of women felt uncomfortable discussing menopause due to societal stigma.
Sarah (28:00)
Wow, that's significant.
Laura Gordon (28:02)
There's an historical marginalization of women's health issues, right? We know that there's research more and more that is showing that. And this affects the way we talk about these things. And there's also like how this affects us interpersonally in the workplace. You know, think about like, now I'm going to work and I'm going through this period of time where
you know, without me knowing it one moment, I can be totally fine. And the next one, I'm going through a hot flash or the next moment I'm having, you know, some mood dysregulation. And there's some people who feel really challenged at work, especially like they're going to be seen differently. And ageism in the workplace. This is where yeah, and it's real. And this is where this can come into play. So yeah, there's there's other challenges that go along with it as well.
Sarah (28:38)
Mm-hmm. It's real.
Mm-hmm.
Yeah. So what are some tips on how folks can care for themselves if they're maybe thinking, I might be having some perimenopausal symptoms, or maybe they're like, shit, I definitely am having some perimenopausal symptoms. How, how, like what? Yeah, you're describing my experience to a T. What can people do to kind of care for themselves through it?
Laura Gordon (29:00)
Yeah, like, what is happening?
I mean, it really, think is putting yourself first, right? And first in that is finding healthcare providers that you trust and you feel safe with, right? This is, I think we just, we don't say enough about how important that is. There are still so many places in the healthcare system where people feel unsafe, unheard, unseen.
And so, you know, making sure that the providers with whom you're working are people you feel comfortable with, you feel safe with, and you can get, you know, get recommendations from others that you know who are having those experiences, talk to other people. there was a study in 2021 that talked about how over 50 % of women feel that their healthcare providers are not adequately trained in menopause management. So, yeah, that's
Sarah (29:56)
that yeah.
Laura Gordon (29:59)
you know, maybe you're going to a GYN, you know, who has more experience and more understanding, but like your primary care physician needs to know what the heck's going on, right? Other physicians need to understand the intersection of this with other things going on in your life. So, yeah, I mean, feeling safe, feeling heard, feeling like you have physicians who are, or providers who are competent, who understand. so I think that for sure.
Sarah (30:07)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yes.
Laura Gordon (30:24)
so that's one aspect of support, right? And the other aspect of support is you can find support through therapy. You can find support. There's support groups out there. There's one like big support group, that's called the red hot mama support group, right? That comes up in a lot of places. It's for perimenopause menopause support. Yeah, there's, there's also a lot of social media groups out there, like, Facebook groups, you know, other groups out there that people, there's meetups,
Sarah (30:30)
Mm-hmm.
that's
Laura Gordon (30:49)
And sometimes like local facilities, like maybe it's a OBGYN office or maybe a hospital might have some sort of support group around this or like a series. really in your area, checking out what's going on or talking to your doctor, do you know of anything, calling your OBGYN? But I think too, like for me, a really easy, well,
Sarah (31:03)
Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (31:09)
a potentially easy one, depending on the women in your life, let me say this, or the people in your life, is talking to trusted others who have been through this, right? Like this is where their wisdom especially can be amazing. I'm really fortunate to have a lot of women in my life who are more like my mother's age. And these are things that I can talk with them about and they can be open with me, especially because my mom's not here.
Sarah (31:12)
Yep.
Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (31:33)
My mom's deceased and my mom went through early menopause because she had surgery. yeah, just those trusted women in your life, whether they're your age or older, who can just like be there for you and commiserate with you at times, laugh with you, support you. This is where I think the people we surround ourselves with really matters. Yeah.
Sarah (31:37)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, so you feel less alone.
Laura Gordon (31:57)
Yeah, for sure, for sure. Another aspect of support that came to mind was finding a good intuitive eating dietician to work with. And the reason for that, again, we talked about earlier, because some of these symptoms can be exacerbated. There's all of these things out there about changing your diet. And doctors will say, diet, lose weight, right? It's the same old same old at this age that it was at every other age.
Sarah (32:05)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yep.
Laura Gordon (32:20)
So having a provider who can really support you in listening to your body and learning to trust your body. And I believe intuitive eating dietitians are really great at that. Yeah, for sure. For sure. So yeah, like just having this like network of support, utilizing it, availing yourself of the information that's out there, becoming informed yourself, whether it's, you know, the book that we talked about, there's tons of podcasts now.
Sarah (32:30)
Absolutely. Yeah, they can help you find the nuance in all of it,
Laura Gordon (32:48)
You know, there's other things out there that are available. So just reading up on it as you can or listening to a podcast might help you to feel a little more connected and will less alone. And then overall, it's just like taking care of yourself, right? Like managing your stress. And this is where things like, you know, mindfulness, meditation, yoga. This is also a stage of life where we talk about joyful movement and eating disorder recovery. Joyful movement here, too, right?
Sarah (32:58)
Mm-hmm.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (33:14)
And we're not talking like you don't have to go out and run a marathon. But what are things you do to keep your body moving? And what are the things that you can do as well to keep yourself healthy? something as simple as staying hydrated. But a big one that comes up in a lot of places that I've been reading is to quit smoking if you smoke, because that just exacerbates everything.
Sarah (33:17)
Yeah. Yeah.
Yeah.
Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
Laura Gordon (33:37)
So you might need to avail yourself of some smoking cessation support as well, if that's the case. So those are some ideas for how to care for yourself. And I think the other part of this that I want to mention as well is if you have a partner, to be able to talk to your partner about what's going on in a way that is open and understanding.
Sarah (33:42)
Yeah.
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (33:59)
this might impact your relationship to a degree where you might need some outside help. Maybe you need to see a couples therapist, get some support that way, or meet with your pastor or something like that, right? But it could test aspects of the relationship. This is also a time when many couples who have had children find that the children are leaving the home. So there's a shift as well. And I always say, you know, this is a really great time to think about
Sarah (34:21)
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (34:24)
Maybe we could use help sitting with someone else who can help us to understand and communicate better with one another. But we need our partner's support, but also our partner needs our support too. So utilizing what's available to you there as well, I think is really important.
Sarah (34:35)
Mm-hmm. Yeah.
Yeah, well this feels so helpful. I think that people will feel really seen and informed and yeah, like we said, something that isn't discussed enough. If it was, then we probably wouldn't be recording this episode.
Laura Gordon (34:53)
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Indeed. Indeed. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yeah. And it's coming up a lot. I think I know women that I see now I my caseload often is women who are of this age range, but it's coming up more and more. And as a therapist, it's something that I've had to be like, wait a minute. I need to consider this as part of what's going on in their lives as well that, you know, maybe the trigger here is
Sarah (35:15)
Yeah.
Laura Gordon (35:17)
some embodied trauma from the past because of perimenopause And we're looking for something else that it isn't, right?
Sarah (35:24)
Right, right. And we're just like piling dysregulation on dysregulation that's already there.
Laura Gordon (35:27)
Yeah. Yeah. So yeah, any type of, you know, emotional regulation, I think at any age is helpful. So those practices of nervous system regulation. And there's tons of resources out there as well. And you can work with a really great therapist who can walk you through that too. And we're here. Yeah.
Sarah (35:33)
Mm-hmm. Yes.
And right here. Yeah. Well, thank you so much for sharing all of this and we'll be sure to link the book in the show notes so that folks can check that out. It has a really lovely cover. Hold it up again for you too.
Laura Gordon (35:47)
Mm-hmm.
Mm hmm. Mm hmm. Mm hmm. yeah. What fresh hell is this? Wee. Yep. It's funny to the little like bullet points or little flames to throughout the. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.
Sarah (35:58)
I love it, flames.
that's hysterical. I love it. Perfect. Well, thank you again. And we'll be back next week, everybody. So we'll talk to you then.
Reclaim Therapy is a group of trauma therapists that provide therapy for eating disorders, EMDR Therapy and therapy or Complex PTSD.
Our team is passionate about helping people reclaim their lives from diet culture, body shame and the impact of trauma.
We would love to support you as you Reclaim YOU and the life that you undeniably deserve.